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QF Group possible Redundancy Numbers/Packages

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QF Group possible Redundancy Numbers/Packages

Old 7th Jun 2020, 02:15
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QF Group possible Redundancy Numbers/Packages

This topic seems to have been raised a couple of times in other threads, so to avoid the continued hijack of threads important to others (Air NZ), perhaps the rumors/info could be collated here?

Potential Redundancies are an interesting, though alarming topic none the less, and although We have been told it’s not on the cards, it’s an entirely possible direction.

Of particular interest may be rumors surrounding a potential Voluntary Redundancy package in the works. The details of which, and the rumored target market, is I’m sure of great interest to many of us.
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Old 7th Jun 2020, 02:22
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Originally Posted by ExtraShot
This topic seems to have been raised a couple of times in other threads, so to avoid the continued hijack of threads important to others (Air NZ), perhaps the rumors/info could be collated here?

Potential Redundancies are an interesting, though alarming topic none the less, and although We have been told it’s not on the cards, it’s an entirely possible direction.

Of particular interest may be rumors surrounding a potential Voluntary Redundancy package in the works. The details of which, and the rumored target market, is I’m sure of great interest to many of us.
Or......rather than speculate or circulate rumours we could simply wait a few weeks and be told what is happening after they determine the fleet/flying plan and crew requirements going forward.
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Old 7th Jun 2020, 02:38
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Well just announced by McCormack the Government will continue to underwrite flights until September. Every bit helps!

The federal government will continue to underwrite domestic flights operated by Qantas, Virgin and Regional Express between capital cities and regional destinations, even as airlines start to add capacity back into their networks in response to rising traveller demand.
Deputy prime minister and minister for transport Michael McCormack will announce on Sunday the government will extend its support package for domestic flights, due to expire Monday, through to September 30.
It will extend financial support for regional airlines to "ensure regional communities continue to receive essential air services" from a September 30 end date to December 31.
“The Australian Government is doing everything possible to ensure the aviation industry is sustained throughout the pandemic so that it can rebound on the other side,” Mr McCormack said.
"The measures announced today will help ensure Australian airlines and operators can maintain essential air services as we map out our economic recovery.”
The original domestic flight package was worth $165 million and enabled Qantas and Virgin to operate around 120 return flights a week. New contracts for the second round of the support package have not been finalised.
The government will also extend a waiver of government operational charges and fuel taxes for airlines; extended a $100 million grants package for regional airlines, and extended partial relief from land tax charges for major airports.
Qantas this week said it will ramp-up its domestic flying from around 5 per cent of its pre-pandemic capacity to 15 per cent by the end of June and to 40 per cent by the end of July, depending on when state borders re-opened.
The airline's boss Alan Joyce said there was pent up demand for travel and his airline had already experienced a surge in bookings for intra-state leisure routes such as Sydney to Ballina (Byron Bay), Perth to Broome and Brisbane to Cairns as pandemic travel restrictions eased.
The federal government was been criticised for not stepping in to prevent Virgin Australia going into voluntary administration in April, with the airline saying the waiving of fuel taxes and landing fees were of little benefit when most of its fleet was grounded due to COVID-19.
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Old 7th Jun 2020, 02:43
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Originally Posted by KZ Kiwi
Or......rather than speculate or circulate rumours we could simply wait a few weeks and be told what is happening after they determine the fleet/flying plan and crew requirements going forward.

Erm. If you aren’t into speculation or the circulation of rumors I think you’re on the wrong website.
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Old 7th Jun 2020, 02:54
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Why would they offer VR packages when they can just stand you down indefinitely? Unless you are referring to the 747 fleet. But again, if they never "retire" the fleet, they can just leave you stood down.

As management and HR have consistently said, there is no time limit to the stand down. This came from the same people who said you cant use sick leave while stood down. We all know how that concluded in the courts.

You would assume they have down the homework on this as well.
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Old 7th Jun 2020, 02:59
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Norm. The initial package would most likely be directed at 747 guys and gals. They have to admit it is retired soon and that will trigger a RIN.
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Old 7th Jun 2020, 03:24
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Bit hard to RIN when nothing is flying...they could do a RIN, but chances are the training for it will be way in the future anyway.
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Old 7th Jun 2020, 03:30
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Originally Posted by ExtraShot
Erm. If you aren’t into speculation or the circulation of rumors I think you’re on the wrong website.
Good one.....

Rumours and speculation do nothing except increase anxiety levels in those vulnerable and most exposed. But go ahead and fill your boots. Have fun
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Old 7th Jun 2020, 05:19
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Originally Posted by Chad Gates
Norm. The initial package would most likely be directed at 747 guys and gals. They have to admit it is retired soon and that will trigger a RIN.

I’m trying to recall the details of the last VR package offered a couple of years back. A RIN is likely quite a lot more expensive.

I remember it was limited to who could take it by rank and fleet (747/767?), but the more exact details of it escape me. I also recall that pretty shortly after it was completed they ended up with a shortage on the 747 and had to train back onto it... thats obviously unlikely to happen this time.
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Old 7th Jun 2020, 06:28
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Originally Posted by ExtraShot
... thats obviously unlikely to happen this time.
Oh, so you're new to Aviation...
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Old 7th Jun 2020, 06:50
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Extrashot, it was a little more than a couple of years ago but by memory it was something in the region of 18 months pay + leave entitlements VR offered to 767/747 pilots, mainly Captains took it.
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Old 7th Jun 2020, 06:54
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Originally Posted by normanton
Why would they offer VR packages when they can just stand you down indefinitely? Unless you are referring to the 747 fleet. But again, if they never "retire" the fleet, they can just leave you stood down.

As management and HR have consistently said, there is no time limit to the stand down. This came from the same people who said you cant use sick leave while stood down. We all know how that concluded in the courts.

You would assume they have down the homework on this as well.
I guess if you make people redundant now you can re hire them on lesser contracts?
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Old 7th Jun 2020, 07:36
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Federal Government guarantees domestic aviation network

McCormack Press Release link here (FOR what the Talking Points/Words maybe, worth....) : https://minister.infrastructure.gov....iation-network

Extract here:

Federal Government guarantees domestic aviation network

Qantas and Virgin Australia Groups will operate a minimum domestic network servicing the most critical metropolitan and regional routes in Australia thanks to a significant investment from the Federal Government of up to an initial $165 million.

Underwriting the cost of the network, which includes all state and territory capital cities and major regional centres such as Albury, Alice Springs, Coffs Harbour, Dubbo, Kalgoorlie, Mildura, Port Lincoln, Rockhampton, Tamworth, Townsville and Wagga Wagga, comes in addition to the more than $1 billion of Federal Government support for Australia’s aviation industry in response to the COVID-19 pandemic.

Deputy Prime Minister and Minister for Infrastructure, Transport and Regional Development Michael McCormack said sustaining Australia’s aviation industry is critical to protecting livelihoods and saving lives and that’s why the Government has acted again today to provide further support.

"As Australians are asked to stay home unless absolutely necessary, we are ensuring secure and affordable access for passengers who need to travel, including our essential workers such as frontline medical personnel and defence personnel, as well as supporting the movement of essential freight such as critical medicine and personal protective equipment," Mr McCormack said.

"We know that a strong domestic aviation network is critical to Australia’s success and today’s announcement demonstrates our commitment, yet again, to maintaining connectivity during this pandemic.

"This investment will also help Australians returning from overseas, who find themselves in a different city after 14 days of mandatory quarantine, complete their journey home safely."

This announcement complements the actions the Federal Liberal and Nationals Government has already taken to underwrite international flights to help Australians get home, as well as flights to our regional and remote communities through the $198 million Regional Airlines Network Support program announced on 28 March and the $715 million package announced on 18 March.

These arrangements will last for an initial eight weeks with a review mechanism in place, where the Government will continue to monitor the market and determine if further action is required..

We continue to support every Australian to get to the other side of this pandemic with more than $320 billion of investment, including our $130 billion JobKeeper Payment to support workers and businesses.

Media Contact:

Mr McCormack – Tess Salmon 0467 740 017 | Dean Shachar 0418 202 860
Rgds all
S28- BE

Last edited by Section28- BE; 7th Jun 2020 at 07:46. Reason: Read 'it'............
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Old 7th Jun 2020, 08:05
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Originally Posted by Angle of Attack
Extrashot, it was a little more than a couple of years ago but by memory it was something in the region of 18 months pay + leave entitlements VR offered to 767/747 pilots, mainly Captains took it.

Cheers. Yes, I do remember it being not too bad of an offer. Not extremely wide ranging in terms of who was eligible though.
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Old 7th Jun 2020, 08:19
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If you believe that redundancies aren't on the way across the board within the Qantas group, you’re living in an alternate reality. The increasing cost in accruing annual leave without any flying across some fleets is a cost Qantas can do without. The only question is whether it will be done on seniority or fleet. With the get out of jail free card, and the importance of reducing expenditure, my guess is it will be done by fleet to save in training cost.
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Old 7th Jun 2020, 08:49
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I think international across the group maybe, domestic crews should be fine if there is some on domestic tho I wonder if any will be made redundant on the 717 now QF have purchased it!
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Old 7th Jun 2020, 10:09
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dolphi is right. If people aren’t mentally preparing for the possibility of a redundancy, (Int’l or Dom) then the fall from grace will hurt a lot more. If it doesn’t eventuate then great, but I can’t see QF escaping it. If you don’t want to think about it, don’t read this forum.

Good luck all
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Old 7th Jun 2020, 10:57
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In 2015 the VR was 12 months. A VR is at the companies discretion and is a minimum of 26 weeks, that means if they don’t want to they can go straight to CR which is . The following package will apply to a pilot who is made compulsorily redundant:
(a) three (3) weeks’ pay for each completed year of service up to and including five (5) years’ service, with a minimum of four (4) weeks’ pay;
(b) four (4) weeks’ pay for each completed year of service in excess of five (5) years;

Further 3 months notice of CR is required. It was alluded to last week by the CP that we would be hearing news shortly we do not want to hear. AIPA are meeting Qantas on Wednesday to discuss VR or CR I don’t know which. Three months notice from the end of this month is the end September when jobkeeper finishes. As Green.Dot says above if you do want to think about it don’t read this forum. I would like to think that they can handle the numbers thru VR , LWOP and maybe something that they have done in the past and that’s leave with pay.
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Old 7th Jun 2020, 11:01
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Originally Posted by dragon man
It was alluded to last week by the CP that we would be hearing news shortly we do not want to hear.
I must have missed that. What was said?
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Old 7th Jun 2020, 11:28
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I don’t want to see it but I think you you would have to say AirNZ is probably a good guide to the future of the red rat, The only saviour would be the collapse of VA. I think that is the only thing delaying the inbound management emails of consultation, right sizing, facing the future etc,etc. I just can’t see any substantial International travel for 12 months minimum. It might get worse too now if all the self serving protestors who are above all law abiding citizens kick this thing off again. I’m not sure how the state premiers can keep the borders shut now when they turn a blind eye to 20000 in the streets holding hands. That may help get airlines back in a more meaningful way conversely, the next two weeks will see.
.
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