Go Back  PPRuNe Forums > PPRuNe Worldwide > Australia, New Zealand & the Pacific
Reload this Page >

QF Group possible Redundancy Numbers/Packages

Australia, New Zealand & the Pacific Airline and RPT Rumours & News in Australia, enZed and the Pacific

QF Group possible Redundancy Numbers/Packages

Old 7th Jun 2020, 02:15
  #1 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: Lagrangian point 2
Posts: 195
QF Group possible Redundancy Numbers/Packages

This topic seems to have been raised a couple of times in other threads, so to avoid the continued hijack of threads important to others (Air NZ), perhaps the rumors/info could be collated here?

Potential Redundancies are an interesting, though alarming topic none the less, and although We have been told itís not on the cards, itís an entirely possible direction.

Of particular interest may be rumors surrounding a potential Voluntary Redundancy package in the works. The details of which, and the rumored target market, is Iím sure of great interest to many of us.
ExtraShot is offline  
Old 7th Jun 2020, 02:22
  #2 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Earth
Posts: 135
Originally Posted by ExtraShot View Post
This topic seems to have been raised a couple of times in other threads, so to avoid the continued hijack of threads important to others (Air NZ), perhaps the rumors/info could be collated here?

Potential Redundancies are an interesting, though alarming topic none the less, and although We have been told itís not on the cards, itís an entirely possible direction.

Of particular interest may be rumors surrounding a potential Voluntary Redundancy package in the works. The details of which, and the rumored target market, is Iím sure of great interest to many of us.
Or......rather than speculate or circulate rumours we could simply wait a few weeks and be told what is happening after they determine the fleet/flying plan and crew requirements going forward.
KZ Kiwi is offline  
Old 7th Jun 2020, 02:38
  #3 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2019
Location: Denmark
Posts: 209
Well just announced by McCormack the Government will continue to underwrite flights until September. Every bit helps!

The federal government will continue to underwrite domestic flights operated by Qantas, Virgin and Regional Express between capital cities and regional destinations, even as airlines start to add capacity back into their networks in response to rising traveller demand.
Deputy prime minister and minister for transport Michael McCormack will announce on Sunday the government will extend its support package for domestic flights, due to expire Monday, through to September 30.
It will extend financial support for regional airlines to "ensure regional communities continue to receive essential air services" from a September 30 end date to December 31.
“The Australian Government is doing everything possible to ensure the aviation industry is sustained throughout the pandemic so that it can rebound on the other side,” Mr McCormack said.
"The measures announced today will help ensure Australian airlines and operators can maintain essential air services as we map out our economic recovery.”
The original domestic flight package was worth $165 million and enabled Qantas and Virgin to operate around 120 return flights a week. New contracts for the second round of the support package have not been finalised.
The government will also extend a waiver of government operational charges and fuel taxes for airlines; extended a $100 million grants package for regional airlines, and extended partial relief from land tax charges for major airports.
Qantas this week said it will ramp-up its domestic flying from around 5 per cent of its pre-pandemic capacity to 15 per cent by the end of June and to 40 per cent by the end of July, depending on when state borders re-opened.
The airline's boss Alan Joyce said there was pent up demand for travel and his airline had already experienced a surge in bookings for intra-state leisure routes such as Sydney to Ballina (Byron Bay), Perth to Broome and Brisbane to Cairns as pandemic travel restrictions eased.
The federal government was been criticised for not stepping in to prevent Virgin Australia going into voluntary administration in April, with the airline saying the waiving of fuel taxes and landing fees were of little benefit when most of its fleet was grounded due to COVID-19.
Ragnor is online now  
Old 7th Jun 2020, 02:43
  #4 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: Lagrangian point 2
Posts: 195
Originally Posted by KZ Kiwi View Post
Or......rather than speculate or circulate rumours we could simply wait a few weeks and be told what is happening after they determine the fleet/flying plan and crew requirements going forward.

Erm. If you arenít into speculation or the circulation of rumors I think youíre on the wrong website.
ExtraShot is offline  
Old 7th Jun 2020, 02:54
  #5 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Sydney
Age: 37
Posts: 388
Why would they offer VR packages when they can just stand you down indefinitely? Unless you are referring to the 747 fleet. But again, if they never "retire" the fleet, they can just leave you stood down.

As management and HR have consistently said, there is no time limit to the stand down. This came from the same people who said you cant use sick leave while stood down. We all know how that concluded in the courts.

You would assume they have down the homework on this as well.
normanton is offline  
Old 7th Jun 2020, 02:59
  #6 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Australia
Posts: 86
Norm. The initial package would most likely be directed at 747 guys and gals. They have to admit it is retired soon and that will trigger a RIN.
Chad Gates is offline  
Old 7th Jun 2020, 03:24
  #7 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 139
Bit hard to RIN when nothing is flying...they could do a RIN, but chances are the training for it will be way in the future anyway.
cloudsurfng is online now  
Old 7th Jun 2020, 03:30
  #8 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Earth
Posts: 135
Originally Posted by ExtraShot View Post
Erm. If you arenít into speculation or the circulation of rumors I think youíre on the wrong website.
Good one.....

Rumours and speculation do nothing except increase anxiety levels in those vulnerable and most exposed. But go ahead and fill your boots. Have fun
KZ Kiwi is offline  
Old 7th Jun 2020, 05:19
  #9 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: Lagrangian point 2
Posts: 195
Originally Posted by Chad Gates View Post
Norm. The initial package would most likely be directed at 747 guys and gals. They have to admit it is retired soon and that will trigger a RIN.

Iím trying to recall the details of the last VR package offered a couple of years back. A RIN is likely quite a lot more expensive.

I remember it was limited to who could take it by rank and fleet (747/767?), but the more exact details of it escape me. I also recall that pretty shortly after it was completed they ended up with a shortage on the 747 and had to train back onto it... thats obviously unlikely to happen this time.
ExtraShot is offline  
Old 7th Jun 2020, 06:28
  #10 (permalink)  

Evertonian
 
Join Date: May 2000
Location: #3117# Ppruner of the Year Nominee 2005
Posts: 10,261
Originally Posted by ExtraShot View Post
... thats obviously unlikely to happen this time.
Oh, so you're new to Aviation...
Buster Hyman is offline  
Old 7th Jun 2020, 06:50
  #11 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: I prefer to remain north of a direct line BNE-ADL
Age: 45
Posts: 1,103
Extrashot, it was a little more than a couple of years ago but by memory it was something in the region of 18 months pay + leave entitlements VR offered to 767/747 pilots, mainly Captains took it.
Angle of Attack is offline  
Old 7th Jun 2020, 06:54
  #12 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Sydney
Posts: 162
Originally Posted by normanton View Post
Why would they offer VR packages when they can just stand you down indefinitely? Unless you are referring to the 747 fleet. But again, if they never "retire" the fleet, they can just leave you stood down.

As management and HR have consistently said, there is no time limit to the stand down. This came from the same people who said you cant use sick leave while stood down. We all know how that concluded in the courts.

You would assume they have down the homework on this as well.
I guess if you make people redundant now you can re hire them on lesser contracts?
ANstar is offline  
Old 7th Jun 2020, 07:07
  #13 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: The Cuckoos nest
Posts: 65
What was offered in the past doesn't need to be offered now. What is offered to one pilot doesn't need to be offered to someone else. Avagoodone.
A little birdie is offline  
Old 7th Jun 2020, 07:36
  #14 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: BAO
Posts: 329
Federal Government guarantees domestic aviation network

McCormack Press Release link here (FOR what the Talking Points/Words maybe, worth....) : https://minister.infrastructure.gov....iation-network

Extract here:

Federal Government guarantees domestic aviation network

Qantas and Virgin Australia Groups will operate a minimum domestic network servicing the most critical metropolitan and regional routes in Australia thanks to a significant investment from the Federal Government of up to an initial $165 million.

Underwriting the cost of the network, which includes all state and territory capital cities and major regional centres such as Albury, Alice Springs, Coffs Harbour, Dubbo, Kalgoorlie, Mildura, Port Lincoln, Rockhampton, Tamworth, Townsville and Wagga Wagga, comes in addition to the more than $1 billion of Federal Government support for Australiaís aviation industry in response to the COVID-19 pandemic.

Deputy Prime Minister and Minister for Infrastructure, Transport and Regional Development Michael McCormack said sustaining Australiaís aviation industry is critical to protecting livelihoods and saving lives and thatís why the Government has acted again today to provide further support.

"As Australians are asked to stay home unless absolutely necessary, we are ensuring secure and affordable access for passengers who need to travel, including our essential workers such as frontline medical personnel and defence personnel, as well as supporting the movement of essential freight such as critical medicine and personal protective equipment," Mr McCormack said.

"We know that a strong domestic aviation network is critical to Australiaís success and todayís announcement demonstrates our commitment, yet again, to maintaining connectivity during this pandemic.

"This investment will also help Australians returning from overseas, who find themselves in a different city after 14 days of mandatory quarantine, complete their journey home safely."

This announcement complements the actions the Federal Liberal and Nationals Government has already taken to underwrite international flights to help Australians get home, as well as flights to our regional and remote communities through the $198 million Regional Airlines Network Support program announced on 28 March and the $715 million package announced on 18 March.

These arrangements will last for an initial eight weeks with a review mechanism in place, where the Government will continue to monitor the market and determine if further action is required..

We continue to support every Australian to get to the other side of this pandemic with more than $320 billion of investment, including our $130 billion JobKeeper Payment to support workers and businesses.

Media Contact:

Mr McCormack Ė Tess Salmon 0467 740 017 | Dean Shachar 0418 202 860
Rgds all
S28- BE

Last edited by Section28- BE; 7th Jun 2020 at 07:46. Reason: Read 'it'............
Section28- BE is offline  
Old 7th Jun 2020, 08:05
  #15 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: Lagrangian point 2
Posts: 195
Originally Posted by Angle of Attack View Post
Extrashot, it was a little more than a couple of years ago but by memory it was something in the region of 18 months pay + leave entitlements VR offered to 767/747 pilots, mainly Captains took it.

Cheers. Yes, I do remember it being not too bad of an offer. Not extremely wide ranging in terms of who was eligible though.
ExtraShot is offline  
Old 7th Jun 2020, 08:19
  #16 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2020
Location: USA
Posts: 3
If you believe that redundancies aren't on the way across the board within the Qantas group, youíre living in an alternate reality. The increasing cost in accruing annual leave without any flying across some fleets is a cost Qantas can do without. The only question is whether it will be done on seniority or fleet. With the get out of jail free card, and the importance of reducing expenditure, my guess is it will be done by fleet to save in training cost.
dolphi is offline  
Old 7th Jun 2020, 08:49
  #17 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2019
Location: Denmark
Posts: 209
I think international across the group maybe, domestic crews should be fine if there is some on domestic tho I wonder if any will be made redundant on the 717 now QF have purchased it!
Ragnor is online now  
Old 7th Jun 2020, 10:09
  #18 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2019
Location: HKG
Posts: 96
dolphi is right. If people arenít mentally preparing for the possibility of a redundancy, (Intíl or Dom) then the fall from grace will hurt a lot more. If it doesnít eventuate then great, but I canít see QF escaping it. If you donít want to think about it, donít read this forum.

Good luck all
Green.Dot is offline  
Old 7th Jun 2020, 10:57
  #19 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: sydney
Posts: 1,152
In 2015 the VR was 12 months. A VR is at the companies discretion and is a minimum of 26 weeks, that means if they don’t want to they can go straight to CR which is . The following package will apply to a pilot who is made compulsorily redundant:
(a) three (3) weeks’ pay for each completed year of service up to and including five (5) years’ service, with a minimum of four (4) weeks’ pay;
(b) four (4) weeks’ pay for each completed year of service in excess of five (5) years;

Further 3 months notice of CR is required. It was alluded to last week by the CP that we would be hearing news shortly we do not want to hear. AIPA are meeting Qantas on Wednesday to discuss VR or CR I don’t know which. Three months notice from the end of this month is the end September when jobkeeper finishes. As Green.Dot says above if you do want to think about it don’t read this forum. I would like to think that they can handle the numbers thru VR , LWOP and maybe something that they have done in the past and that’s leave with pay.
dragon man is online now  
Old 7th Jun 2020, 11:01
  #20 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Australia
Posts: 404
Originally Posted by dragon man View Post
It was alluded to last week by the CP that we would be hearing news shortly we do not want to hear.
I must have missed that. What was said?
ruprecht is online now  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information

Copyright © 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.