Virgin 3.1

[The Butcher's Dog]

Truth or not - what a "no win" comment, what positive spin could you possibly make from this. For those supportive of that kind of thinking and logic, there could be no explaining the reasons that would make this an unacceptable path. Such a Soylent Green revelation....................

[Paragraph377]

Originally Posted by The Bunglerat

I'm no fan of JH, but in this instance she's not wrong. Covid has exposed Australia as a hermit nation, populated by a disproportionate number of sissies who jump at their own shadows. What the hell is wrong with you people...?!? Previous generations lived with all manner of viruses and debilitating - even fatal - diseases for which there were no vaccines or cure. They didn't curl up in a foetal position and retreat to their designated safe space, they accepted that risk is a part of life and got on with living.

10/10 comment. You also score an A+

[Agent_86]

VA launch new program to win back 'Guests' - https://chaser.com.au/national/virgi...ier-programme/

[machtuk]

Originally Posted by The Bunglerat

I'm no fan of JH, but in this instance she's not wrong. Covid has exposed Australia as a hermit nation, populated by a disproportionate number of sissies who jump at their own shadows. What the hell is wrong with you people...?!? Previous generations lived with all manner of viruses and debilitating - even fatal - diseases for which there were no vaccines or cure. They didn't curl up in a foetal position and retreat to their designated safe space, they accepted that risk is a part of life and got on with living.

This is probably the best thing I've read during this whole Covid bull**** debarcle!

[Paragraph377]

Originally Posted by The Butcher's Dog

Truth or not - what a "no win" comment, what positive spin could you possibly make from this. For those supportive of that kind of thinking and logic, there could be no explaining the reasons that would make this an unacceptable path. Such a Soylent Green revelation....................

10/10 comment. You score an A+

[43Inches]

Yep, a great comment for an "airline boss" to make. Not the industry to highlight you are willing to sacrifice peoples lives for profit, now, how many planes are you willing to lose whilst reducing maintenance or training costs? 1%-5% this is your acceptable loss rate it sounds like. So I'll have up to a 1:20 chance of my plane crashing if I fly Virgin? Does not sound as appealing when you relate it to air travel does it.

[chuboy]

Shame to see so many transport pilots in this thread who are averse to "risk aversion". I hope your gung-ho mentality is confined to armchair commentating about infectious disease epidemiology and other matters about which you know very little, and not to your decision making on the flight deck

[timbo1]

I am reminded of the line in Shrek from Lord Farquaad - Some of you may die - but its a sacrifice I am prepared to make - apparently for the sake of my bonus

[Paragraph377]

Originally Posted by chuboy

Shame to see so many transport pilots in this thread who are averse to "risk aversion". I hope your gung-ho mentality is confined to armchair commentating about infectious disease epidemiology and other matters about which you know very little, and not to your decision making on the flight deck

And you are an epidemiologist who knows better than the ‘armchair commentators’? The argument swings both ways. Should pilots be making flight deck decisions during the flu season when around 500,000 die annually and around 3 to 5 million catch it? What about a pilot who is undergoing personal stress or anxiety, how do you measure that data? Seriously, hardly anyone is denying the existence of COVID, the deaths, and the short and long term side effects. And nobody is saying a Pilot should still fly if and while affected, but to keep locking down states and countries is a complete joke. Should commercial aircraft in general be banned? After all, they are not ‘green and environmentally friendly’ and around 2.4% of global CO2 emissions come from aviation. Together with other gases and aircraft water vapour trails the industry is responsible for 5% of global warming.

And for the record, third world countries and/or despotic countries are always going to have higher percentage rates with any disease due to these reasons - no food, no water, no shelter, no medicine and/or being held to ransom by incompetent corrupt political readers. And some of those countries have a billion citizens so the numbers will be higher. Again, 99% of infected people recover. Destroying the global economy is not worth the price.

[chookcooker]

And 99% of that 1% that would have died will now live once vaccinated.

[Ollie Onion]

That is a serious amount of cash (Shares) the new executive team have taken out of the business. These CEO’s are just one big scam.

[Lead Balloon]

So if we vaccinate, and keep vaccinated, our most vulnerable, complete the vaccination program for the rest and continue with sensible (proven) mitigation and containment practices, what are the downsides of opening our borders and why do those downsides outweigh the upsides? (And please, Soylent Green and other analogies are scaremongering irrelevancies.)

[Lookleft]

This is probably why Virgin went belly up in the first place. Some were trying to focus on the airline but the majority were focused on useless discussions and irrelevant diversions.

[43Inches]

So if we vaccinate, and keep vaccinated, our most vulnerable, complete the vaccination program for the rest and continue with sensible (proven) mitigation and containment practices, what are the downsides of opening our borders and why do those downsides outweigh the upsides? (And please, Soylent Green and other analogies are scaremongering irrelevancies.)

First and foremost, we are in the enviable position to be able to wait and watch how the vaccine takes in other countries, like the UK. If case numbers resume growth exponentially then the vaccine is bogus and was a waste of time. We have to remember when you say this is for profits, who pays for the thousands of hospital beds and intubated patients. Its not "free" care, we are going to pay for that in taxes and medicare levies etc etc. Just so some airlines and businesses catering for international students and tourists can make some cash. The domestic market is pretty much back to normal, mining more or less unaffected (by covid that is). This argument is just selfish, 1% is not an insignificant number, its 1 in 100, list the things you do daily that have a 1 in 100 chance of dieing, I can't think of any. For interest sake, flu mortality rate is about 0.05%, but even this is considered a high figure as a lot of cases are not diagnosed, where as the testing for covid is so high we catch a vast number of cases so have good baseline knowledge of actual average mortality rates, being between 1 and 5% depending on genetics, age distribution, healthcare etc.

Again if someone said to you, that if you chose to catch a flight it had a 1 in 100 chance of crashing, would you use air travel?

[ozbiggles]

I have never seen so many pilots in support of a CEO in all my time!

[minigundiplomat]

First and foremost, we are in the enviable position to be able to wait and watch how the vaccine takes in other countries, like the UK. If case numbers continue to grow exponentially then the vaccine is bogus and was a waste of time. We have to remember when you say this is for profits, who pays for the thousands of hospital beds and intubated patients. Its not "free" care, we are going to pay for that in taxes and medicare levies etc etc. Just so some airlines and businesses catering for international students and tourists can make some cash. The domestic market is pretty much back to normal, mining more or less unaffected (by covid that is). This argument is just selfish, 1% is not an insignificant number, its 1 in 100, list the things you do daily that have a 1 in 100 chance of dieing, I can't think of any. For interest sake, flu mortality rate is about 0.05%, but even this is considered a high figure as a lot of cases are not diagnosed, where as the testing for covid is so high we catch a vast number of cases so have good baseline knowledge of actual average mortality rates, being between 1 and 5% depending on genetics, age distribution, healthcare etc.

Again if someone said to you, that if you chose to catch a flight it had a 1 in 100 chance of crashing, would you use air travel?

Stop being such a whiny biatch and grow a pair.

You have a 100% chance of dying at some point, an about 1% chance of it being from the 'Killer Pandemic'; that's less than cancer or heart disease and about on par with croaking in a vehicle accident. I am assuming you're a pilot, and have had to manage risk at some point? Do the same here.

You say 'study what happens in the UK' - I'll tell you what the results are - cases and fatalities are coming down exponentially and there is no evidence that the media mutants beat vaccines. The UK is opening up and booking their overseas holidays.

Vaccinate the vulnerable first, and then everyone else. Borders can open at a suitable point in that process, and we can risk manage from there. Stop pretending you can hide on Magic Island forever, and nobody will die of anything.

[chookcooker]

Originally Posted by 43Inches

First and foremost, we are in the enviable position to be able to wait and watch how the vaccine takes in other countries, like the UK. If case numbers continue to grow exponentially then the vaccine is bogus and was a waste of time.

Continue to grow exponentially?? WTF are you on about?? Let’s look at the UK:

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/uk/


hmmmm plummeting case numbers.

how about Israel?

https://www.worldometers.info/corona...ountry/israel/


wow, almost completely eradicated thanks to vax.

Exponential negative growth perhaps.

[43Inches]

You have a 100% chance of dying at some point, an about 1% chance of it being from the 'Killer Pandemic'; that's less than cancer or heart disease and about on par with croaking in a vehicle accident. I am assuming you're a pilot, and have had to manage risk at some point? Do the same here.

Because I do get out there and do things I have almost died from a bacteria far worse than Covid. That being said, your understanding of statistics is lacking, you don't catch heart disease or cancer, these things are genetic dispositions or some exposure to things that cause them, ie bad diet for heart disease or long term exposure to smoking for cancer. The 1% we discuss with Covid is your chance of dieing from it now, not what your possible eventual cause of death will be. Things that give you 1/100 chance of a heart attack or cancer immediately or quickly resulting in your death are heavily regulated for the safety of the stupid. This is why electricians do your house wiring and strict regulations of food or who can operate machinery etc. Some idiot who does not wish to quarantine can just walk past sneeze on me and I now have Covid and a 1 in 100 chance of dieing from it within a few weeks. Here's a contentious thought, a study on suicide attempts found only 1.5% of attempts using cuts or drugs resulted in death, so people that actually try to kill themselves using medical means are only slightly more likely to die of it than Covid infection.

[chookcooker]

Originally Posted by 43Inches

That being said, your understanding of statistics is lacking

Oh please, with your superior understanding of statistics explain this statement:

Originally Posted by 43Inches

First and foremost, we are in the enviable position to be able to wait and watch how the vaccine takes in other countries, like the UK. If case numbers continue to grow exponentially then the vaccine is bogus and was a waste of time.

[43Inches]

Continue to grow exponentially?? WTF are you on about?? Let’s look at the UK:

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/uk/

That's a good thing, the statement should of had an "if" caveat. The point being we open up when one, the vaccine shows its doing its thing, which appears on track, and two, when sufficient amounts of population have been immunised, which has not occurred in Australia yet. At any point before point 2 occurs the virus could mutate and become more/less virulent, more/less deadly, circumvent the vaccine etc. Why rush to open the borders when you can wait it out in comfort and watch what happens.

I also think you should manage your alcohol intake before posting as that second post makes no sense to rebuff my comment on statistics, amounts that impair your ability to think clearly could lead to heart disease and or cancer.