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Old 13th Sep 2022, 02:28
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Always informative getting financial analysis from someone who doesn't know the difference between negative equity and insolvency.
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Old 13th Sep 2022, 07:30
  #262 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by MickG0105 View Post
Always informative getting financial analysis from someone who doesn't know the difference between negative equity and insolvency.
Simple question is Mick
Could QF/JQ reimburse future flights that had been booked and paid for when the shutdown happened ?
Answer no....
Why ?
They expected things to just keep rolling along without interruption and all would be well
In the past they had assets to back up this "loan" from their customers, to a large extent, these assets no longer exist
And they still have a ton of "vouchers" to honour
This is a worry
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Old 13th Sep 2022, 09:00
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Originally Posted by 43Inches View Post
They did last year, not sure what the point is, but QF has been well and truly caught out with its snout in the trough. The only payment Rex got without strings was the first one, which QF would have received if they were not trying to sink VA. They just waited for VA to fail and started taking the cash afterwards. Have to remember that the assistance is relative to the flying portion. The frequent flyer and freight divisions of QF were profitable all the way through the pandemic.

In any case if its legal its legal, if you ask and receive its up to the gov what strings it attaches and whether its a loan or gift. I could make up some silly thing to do a PHD on like studying if garden worms like beer and get government money. A good manager gets income from whoever offers. AJ played god with the lives of his own staff and those at VA by denying they needed assistance to sink the competition, otherwise both airlines would have received something, there's no doubt. AJ made it political, when it was a commercial imperative.
so was pelair, and regional in QLD and WA. I couldn't care less about either really. He is treating it like footy teams
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Old 13th Sep 2022, 14:09
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Originally Posted by Deano969 View Post
Simple question is Mick
Could QF/JQ reimburse future flights that had been booked and paid for when the shutdown happened ?
Answer no....
Why ?
They expected things to just keep rolling along without interruption and all would be well
In the past they had assets to back up this "loan" from their customers, to a large extent, these assets no longer exist
And they still have a ton of "vouchers" to honour
This is a worry
Simple answer. As usual, you are wrong ... again.

Try reading a financial report before making such manifestly dumb statements. The Qantas Group's position with regards to Cash and cash equivalents versus Unavailed passenger revenue (that is, flights booked and paid for) for end of December 2021, June 2021, December 2020 and June 2020 was as follows:

HY22
Unavailed passenger revenue ... $2.570 Bn
Cash and cash equivalents ....... $2.705 Bn

FY21
Unavailed passenger revenue ... $2.143 Bn
Cash and cash equivalents ...... $2.221 Bn

HY21
Unavailed passenger revenue ... $1.766 Bn
Cash and cash equivalents ....... $2.606 Bn

FY20
Unavailed passenger revenue ... $2.031 Bn
Cash and cash equivalents ....... $3.520 Bn

Hopefully even your grasp of numeracy will extend to understanding that throughout the two year period covering the various shut-downs, the Group held sufficient cash to cover unavailed passenger revenue.

Frankly, your manifest inability to get basic financial matters right is THE worry.

Last edited by MickG0105; 13th Sep 2022 at 14:12. Reason: Formatting
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Old 14th Sep 2022, 00:51
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Is it about time that passenger creditors took a class action to get their money back?

It would be funny if somebody slapped a lien on one of the airplanes.
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Old 14th Sep 2022, 01:04
  #266 (permalink)  
 
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The big issue with credit systems is that the company can just put you on a shorter flight that costs more to remove liabilities for the lowest possible cost. Depends all how the terms are written for the held amounts. Unless the ticket is held as like for like, ie I booked Melbourne - London, so you get the same class ticket regardless of cost. But more than likely its held as a monetary amount, meaning your value for money is probably down considerably.

I had some overseas holidays booked pre-covid, thankfully with no Australian services involved. The US operators offered full refunds, 125% credits for future use or hold of use for like for like travel when things returned to normal. This was similar for others I know had bookings overseas, unless of course you used an Australian travel agent to book it, which you would be stuffed. Our consumer laws just failed completely during covid.

I think there really should be an investigation into how much value for money customers got for their credits.
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Old 14th Sep 2022, 03:08
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Originally Posted by MickG0105 View Post
Simple answer. As usual, you are wrong ... again.

Try reading a financial report before making such manifestly dumb statements. The Qantas Group's position with regards to Cash and cash equivalents versus Unavailed passenger revenue (that is, flights booked and paid for) for end of December 2021, June 2021, December 2020 and June 2020 was as follows:

HY22
Unavailed passenger revenue ... $2.570 Bn
Cash and cash equivalents ....... $2.705 Bn

FY21
Unavailed passenger revenue ... $2.143 Bn
Cash and cash equivalents ...... $2.221 Bn

HY21
Unavailed passenger revenue ... $1.766 Bn
Cash and cash equivalents ....... $2.606 Bn

FY20
Unavailed passenger revenue ... $2.031 Bn
Cash and cash equivalents ....... $3.520 Bn

Hopefully even your grasp of numeracy will extend to understanding that throughout the two year period covering the various shut-downs, the Group held sufficient cash to cover unavailed passenger revenue.

Frankly, your manifest inability to get basic financial matters right is THE worry.
Yep
Looks good on paper and from the accountancy side all is well until
It's not ready cash on hand is it....
It's not including billions in outstanding FFPs is it.....
Selling and leasing back birds only looks good on paper for cash on hand
Flogging off real estate is only a short term fix
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Old 14th Sep 2022, 06:08
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Originally Posted by Deano969 View Post
Yep
Looks good on paper and from the accountancy side all is well until
It's not ready cash on hand is it....
It's not including billions in outstanding FFPs is it.....
Selling and leasing back birds only looks good on paper for cash on hand
Flogging off real estate is only a short term fix
Yes, of course, you'd know better, wouldn't you? It's a wonder some outfit hasn't snapped you up as a CFO.

How about you stop commenting on matters beyond your grasp, making patently dumb statements and then running away from what you've previously said as soon as someone presents actual facts and real data. It should be embarrassing.

Stick to counting seats on Rex flights.
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Old 15th Sep 2022, 04:29
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Originally Posted by MickG0105 View Post
Yes, of course, you'd know better, wouldn't you? It's a wonder some outfit hasn't snapped you up as a CFO.

How about you stop commenting on matters beyond your grasp, making patently dumb statements and then running away from what you've previously said as soon as someone presents actual facts and real data. It should be embarrassing.

Stick to counting seats on Rex flights.
Mick you have simply lifted some figures from QF/JQs AGM and have little grasp of how those figures have come to be
For example $686 million goes from property owned at mascot into cash
Total net assets less liabilities has gone from $443 million to net -$190 million and this includes cash
So in other words, if QF/JQ ceased trading tomorrow, they would not cover their debts, so aside from goodwill the company is worthless


As for counting REX numbers, this was merely to debunk PoppaJo's posts claiming 10-15 per load and predictions that they would never succeed with their jets
I predicted profitable operations by October or November, REX has outdone this and have already put my money where my mouth is and have made 32% over a few months

By the by REX has equity of $152 million as compared with QF/JQ at -$190 million
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Old 15th Sep 2022, 05:10
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Bit rich calling this a success with half a dozen machines. I donít believe itís mathematically even possible to get green earnings from such a fleet. They certainly donít fly them hard. Engineering headwinds will start hitting the bottom line fairly soon as some of these aged machines hit heavy checks.

Be interesting to see what profit margin they are sacrificing here selling every seat via travel agents too.
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Old 15th Sep 2022, 05:19
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Originally Posted by Mr_App View Post
Bit rich calling this a success with half a dozen machines. I donít believe itís mathematically even possible to get green earnings from such a fleet. They certainly donít fly them hard. Engineering headwinds will start hitting the bottom line fairly soon as some of these aged machines hit heavy checks.

Be interesting to see what profit margin they are sacrificing here selling every seat via travel agents too.
Can't make money flying empty
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Old 15th Sep 2022, 05:31
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To be fair, they DID fly empty for a long period of time. They then sold off their ar$es off to online and store travel agents.

However I agree, still better vs flying empty like they used to do.

I see everyone isnít answering that question above though. What happens when Mascot slots taper off from next year?
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Old 15th Sep 2022, 06:19
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Originally Posted by Mr_App View Post
To be fair, they DID fly empty for a long period of time. They then sold off their ar$es off to online and store travel agents.

However I agree, still better vs flying empty like they used to do.

I see everyone isnít answering that question above though. What happens when Mascot slots taper off from next year?
1) Use it or lose it is now in place
2) plenty of slots available outside peak hour
3) ACCC will have something to say if SAC can't find a few slots during peak hour
4) SWA will eventually open
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Old 15th Sep 2022, 07:10
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Use it or lose it is now in place
and QF and VA are pretty much using all their peak slots so I don't know how that helps ZL going forward.

plenty of slots available outside peak hour
that is why they're off-peak... there isn't demand for them.

ACCC will have something to say if SAC can't find a few slots during peak hour
but will they? If the existing slots are all allocated, they can't just conjure up more unless the government lift the movements cap which is really unlikely given 2 of the electorates affected are held by Albanese and Plibersek.

SWA will eventually open
2026!!
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Old 15th Sep 2022, 07:20
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Western Sydney isnít due until Dec 2026. In other words..2028. And likely to become a Stansted type airport, loco focus.

Perhaps Rex could push some Saab flights over West and use those slots for Jet ops. However I do believe Regional slots are protected species.
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Old 15th Sep 2022, 08:45
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Article today in the Australian regarding VA loss included a small mention on Rex, mentions that they will struggle to get any bigger due to limitations no slot availability.

The real question is, if Rex think they’re doing or will do so great why would they be having talks with VA on a possible buyout by VA! VA also said to be in talks with a possible merger with Air NZ! Of course Miss Jayne declined to comment which all could confirm there is so thing going on.
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Old 15th Sep 2022, 08:58
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The Air NZ/VA relationship will likely develop at some point. Donít forget back in the day Jayne and Greg worked alongside at Woolworths. She was on the board while he ran BIGW and later on Woolworths. His connections are strongly down under so Iíd expect some movement eventually.
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Old 15th Sep 2022, 11:52
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Originally Posted by Deano969 View Post
Mick you have simply lifted some figures from QF/JQs AGM and have little grasp of how those figures have come to be
You, lecturing anyone on failing to grasp the subject matter is laughable. You routinely demonstrate that you have NFI what you are talking about, and astoundingly, you manage to pull that off on a wide and varied range of topics. The fact that you would would think that the data I used most recently to prove you wrong (again) came from an Annual General Meeting just underlines your complete failure to grasp corporate financial reporting.

Same same with your ridiculous assertion that Cash and Cash Equivalents are "not ready cash on hand". Try reading an Australian Accounting Standard some time. CCE is current cash on hand.

There is a repeating, and by now tiresome pattern, of you making some utterly ridiculous statement and then, when one of the adults corrects you, you trying to weasel your way out by changing the topic. Stick to counting seats and "frames" or whatever it is that you're paid to do.

Last edited by MickG0105; 15th Sep 2022 at 12:04. Reason: Typo
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Old 15th Sep 2022, 12:17
  #279 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by SHVC View Post
Article today in the Australian regarding VA loss included a small mention on Rex, mentions that they will struggle to get any bigger due to limitations no slot availability.

The real question is, if Rex think theyíre doing or will do so great why would they be having talks with VA on a possible buyout by VA! VA also said to be in talks with a possible merger with Air NZ! Of course Miss Jayne declined to comment which all could confirm there is so thing going on.
Why would anyone bother buying REX? Apart from some clapped out SAABs, what exactly are you buying?

AirNZ/VA does make sense and will probably happen at some stage to give both entities more critical mass. Obviously with the egos of Borghetti and Luxon out of the way, some rapprochement is possible again.

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Old 16th Sep 2022, 06:42
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Air NZ has now publicly 'denied' claims from the Australian media that they were in merger talks with VA.

https://www.flightglobal.com/airline...-hOWXHenKsRV1Y
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