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Gaza Air War

Old 9th Oct 2023, 14:53
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Gaza Air War

I have been reading the Gaza thread on Jetblast with interest but I figured if ever there was a use for a military aviation forum this was it.

Bearing in mind one side has F16s and F35s and the other side has powered hang gliders itís a little asymmetric to say the least but can this be the place we discuss all matters related to air power in the conflict?

BV

The video attached below is one of the most visceral and clear videos Iíve ever seen of the destructive power and accuracy of air launched munitions.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=e5OhTspt0g8

Last edited by Bob Viking; 9th Oct 2023 at 15:03.
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29th Oct 2023, 00:24
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One of the ships headed in Harm's Way is named for a US Enlisted Sailor who was murdered by Hezbollah Terrorists that hijacked a TWA Flight.

Take a mometn to read the article and consider the irony of that ship bering dispatched to confront yet more Hezbollah Terrorism after all the intervening years.

It is a proud ship, named for a very brave young Man who stood up against evil and paid the ultimate price for his gallantry and devotion to duty.

He was a construction diver....not a combat sailor but he lived up to the highest standards of the Naval Service during a very terrible situation.

The connection to the Air War in Gaza.....he represents all those Sailors aboard those ships today and the manner in which they are prepared to do their duty.

We are blessed to have such people serving in our armed services.

https://navylog.navymemorial.org/stethem-robert




Old 9th Oct 2023, 15:06
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IIRC, they are using powered paragliders. Fly a helicopter over the top and the wing will collapse.
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Old 9th Oct 2023, 15:35
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Originally Posted by B Fraser
IIRC, they are using powered paragliders. Fly a helicopter over the top and the wing will collapse.
How close do you have to be, because the guys sat at the front of the paragliders had AKs?

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Old 9th Oct 2023, 16:51
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Anyone see the video of two F16s (sans wings) being towed along a highway? Most bizarre. It wasn't clear whether these were being moved by the Israelis or had been snaffled by Hamas.
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Old 9th Oct 2023, 17:23
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Originally Posted by melmothtw
How close do you have to be, because the guys sat at the front of the paragliders had AKs?
If you're above they obviously have to see you first and if they do so they have to shoot through their canopy. Still would be easier to use the gun on them. Slow and unmaneuverable target, at the same time instable platform for them to return fire. Turkey shoot. Best use API rounds and get the fuel on fire.
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Old 9th Oct 2023, 17:33
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The vortex ring will reduce their inflated canopy to a bag of washing. It could even become quite a fun sport and no ammunition needed.

Edited to add a video, check out around 2:00. The helicopter was some distance away.

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Old 9th Oct 2023, 18:08
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I presume you mean downwash. If you are in vortex ring, the last thing on your mind will be shooting down paragliders
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Old 9th Oct 2023, 18:34
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Originally Posted by Herod
I presume you mean downwash. If you are in vortex ring, the last thing on your mind will be shooting down paragliders
But you'd probably still take them out on the way down!

(Sorry for thread drift BV)
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Old 9th Oct 2023, 18:42
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Originally Posted by Bob Viking
I have been reading the Gaza thread on Jetblast with interest but I figured if ever there was a use for a military aviation forum this was it.

Bearing in mind one side has F16s and F35s and the other side has powered hang gliders it’s a little asymmetric to say the least but can this be the place we discuss all matters related to air power in the conflict?
BV
The video attached below is one of the most visceral and clear videos I’ve ever seen of the destructive power and accuracy of air launched munitions.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=e5OhTspt0g8
I followed the video to the end.
Reminds me of a few tall buildings taken down by strikes in Iraq a couple of decades ago.
How did the Press know to be there? (go to about 0:35 in). Why was the building the one being watched? That fellow already had two cameras set up.

@Overthawk:
Hey, if you can kill 'em with rotor wash, it's still a kill!
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Old 9th Oct 2023, 18:43
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Thanks for the correction, wrong terminology. I only did a few lessons in an R22 for fun. I thought that the downwash had to be balanced by an upwash somewhere else.
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Old 9th Oct 2023, 18:45
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Originally Posted by B Fraser
Thanks for the correction, wrong terminology. I only did a few lessons in an R22 for fun. I thought that the downwash had to be balanced by an upwash somewhere else.
You might say that it is balanced by thrust, but henra may have to correct me on that.
Rotor downwash is a byproduct of the production of lift.
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Old 9th Oct 2023, 19:22
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The motor of paramotor makes a fair old racket, would it drown out the approach of an eggbeater, also not the quietest thing in aviation? The hardest thing would be seeing the paramotor at night in the first place I would have thought.

How about a pass by a jet. the wake vortex from that would be uncomfortable I would have thought, and much harder to hit with an AK47.?
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Old 9th Oct 2023, 19:24
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Originally Posted by Lonewolf_50
How did the Press know to be there? (go to about 0:35 in). Why was the building the one being watched? That fellow already had two cameras set up.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?app=desktop&v=e5OhTspt0g8
There are skyline cameras covering all of Gaza currently cus the press love a building coming down. I'd guess it was pure luck. Or the roof knock might have tipped them off?
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Old 9th Oct 2023, 19:29
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Originally Posted by downsizer
There are skyline cameras covering all of Gaza currently cus the press love a building coming down. I'd guess it was pure luck.
Makes sense to me.
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Old 9th Oct 2023, 19:52
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[QUOTE=Lonewolf_50;11517544]I followed the video to the end.

How did the Press know to be there? (go to about 0:35 in). Why was the building the one being watched? That fellow already had two cameras

In some instances, the buildings owners are given advance notice by the Israelis.
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Old 9th Oct 2023, 20:34
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Others are probably prime targets, Hamas HQ etc, so it makes sense for the press to watch them..

A burst from an Israeli Cobra would see the trikes off.
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Old 9th Oct 2023, 21:55
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Originally Posted by Lonewolf_50
How did the Press know to be there? (go to about 0:35 in). Why was the building the one being watched? That fellow already had two cameras set up.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?app=desktop&v=e5OhTspt0g8
Because what you're seeing is an edited version.
It actually happened on live TV on the Al Jazeera TV news show (I happened to be watching it at the time) and they had a female news reporter on the roof, dressed in helmet/flak jacket etc., with that building as backdrop, just behind her, and she was doing a feed to camera, when the first strike hit the roof, and she dropped down, screamed etc., and studio anchor was asking are you OK etc.,etc., get to safety etc., or can you continue, so the camera was still running when the following strikes hit which dropped most of the building (which is just the bit you see in the video clips being shown around)
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Old 9th Oct 2023, 22:33
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Originally Posted by B Fraser
Thanks for the correction, wrong terminology. I only did a few lessons in an R22 for fun. I thought that the downwash had to be balanced by an upwash somewhere else.
That is generally speaking correct. Vortex ring is a specific (and unhelpful) type of this equalising flow (which indeed always happens but ideally further outside the rotor disc). In Vortex Ring State it is if you like 'condensed' in a 'Donut' shape around the tip plane of the rotor. So instead of the thrust going straight down it quickly dissipates to the outside and back to the top of the rotor disc, thereby significantly reducing effective vertical mass flow and thus thrust of the rotor disc.
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Old 9th Oct 2023, 22:48
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There have been some video (obviously can't find them now) of what was supposedly 'home brewed' SAM. Anyone with more specifics?!
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Old 9th Oct 2023, 22:48
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How did the Press know to be there? (go to about 0:35 in). Why was the building the one being watched? That fellow already had two cameras set up.
Historically the Israeli’s have given a warning when a building is about to be attacked - both via radio and via a “tap”, a small charge dropped on the roof to allow evacuation before the main strike a few minutes later.

That did, of course, allow the probable targets to escape - they news today is they have announced that no further advance warning will be given - and Hamas has said a hostage will be killed for every attack made without a warning.

Example of a “tap”

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